The aim of this guide is to explain, in detail, how you should set up a group (or party) for efficient playing and farming in Path of Exile. This is a vast topic, so we may not cover everything here, but we at least hope to get you well on the way. So, if you want to get a good start to farming some Mirror of Kalandras, this is a good place to begin!
Please note that this is not a guide meant for beginners. We mention several terms and strategies in this guide that we do not explain, but which you should be at least somewhat familiar with if you are going to be able to follow along. You should also be familiar with leveling a Path of Exile character in solo/duo mode (having done it at least once or twice) before attempting this strategy. Even if it is your first time, you will still make it using this guide, but it is unlikely you will reap any benefit.
While there is a variety of applications, strategies, and builds that are usually played in a group setting, we will try to get you acquainted with most of them in here. Generally, a group will need a carry player, a boss killer that is changeable into a build that functions in the group, and, in order of importance:
- Aurabot Necromancer
- Curse Support Occultist
- Discipline Support Champion or Mana Guardian
- Shock Support Elementalist
The Evolution of the Builds Contributing to the Group
I felt like this guide would not be complete if I wouldn’t at least give you guys a little bit of history about the evolution of the signature group archetype builds. Back in the day you would have been laughed at if you weren’t playing an Ascendant accompanied by a Deadeye.
Those two ascendancies were just the bread and butter of group play. With Tornado Shot being the undisputed choice for any map carry in a Magic Find scenario, Deadeye was hard to pass up. With Ascendant giving you everything that Necromancer or Guardian could, there was little reason not to pick it. If you were adding a third and fourth player you wouldn’t have any other choices than Occultist and Guardian.
As Path of Exile has evolved, though, we have been given a variety of options that we could be picking out of nowadays. We will be offering guides for all the options in the near future, but for a quick reference, these are the options currently available to your group:
- Ascendant Auras
- Necromancer Auras
- Guardian Auras
- Occultist Hybrid Aura / Curse
- Occultist Cursebot
- Ice Shot Champion
- Energy Shield Support
- Mana Guardian
- Discipline Support
Why is the Early Game Important?
This section will cover an early game strategy for people who want to league start in a group while aiming to Magic Find maps as soon as possible. This brings us to the first thing you need to understand as to why most well-established groups are this successful: the PoE economy is always changing but follows a very clear decaying model. That means that getting to make sales faster than other players is a huge market advantage. Have you been in a scenario where you had to buy a maps at outrageous prices, but whenever you had some spare, you’d feel like they were worthless?
That’s the situation we want to be in — we want to be selling stuff at high prices before others have access to them.
We need to set up a good leveling strategy and make sure we get to the items faster than others. This is where our Boss killer comes in. He will be responsible to carry your team throughout the acts. We really do not want to spend more than 1 minute killing an act 2 Vaal Oversoul or an act 3 Dominus, for example. Boss killers generally are builds that are very strong throughout the leveling part and ideally are playing a class that can role-swap into something that does relatively well in a group. An example could be Storm Brand Hierophant (swapping into Mana Guardian) or a Ball Lightning Miner (with no real swapping potential, this is generally used when you have more than enough players to fill all roles).
Other than the player who’s responsible for carrying the harder fights throughout the storyline, you also need to make sure that your other team members know what they’re supposed to do at certain points in their progression. Is your Cursebot going to be running as a second act progresser to speed things up and is your Aurabot swapping to full support at level 24? Does your main damage dealer know what type of skills he should be using to maximize leveling speed for himself and whichever of the supports that are grouping with him? Do we need certain Uniques?
Our Cookie-Cutter Suggestion
We’re going to assume you are a 3-player group. We recommend one of you to play a Boss killer that does early-game damage: that is any kind of Witch Ascendancy (Necromancer Volatile Dead, for example), one of you plays a Witch that is meant to swap to full Support at level 24 (such as our Aurabot Necromancer), and your 3rd player plays a Marauder that starts the game with Frost Blades and swaps in to Rain of Arrows at level 12, to be joined by his support at level 24.
We recommend you to put a live search up for at least a Storm Cloud. This will carry your Rain of Arrows player to maps. If possible (or lucky with some cheap finds / good currency drops) you can also pick up a Prismweave to further amplify your carry’s damage so him and the support can keep up with the Boss killer who was tailored to shine in this part of the game.
Besides those two items (and even just the Storm Cloud) there’s nothing you really need to get to Blood Aqueducts in a reasonable fashion, especially if you follow the before mentioned support and carry guides.
When you arrive in Blood Aqueducts, we recommend you pick up any Magic Find you can cheaply acquire (such as Sadima's Touch, Thief's Torment, Perandus Blazon, Bisco's Leash, Bisco's Collar) and keep your Support and Carry player in Blood Aqueducts to farm at least one Tabula Rasa by farming Humility cards . Getting your Rain of Arrows Berserker a Tabula will help his early mapping a lot.
Generic Group Leveling Tips
Try to abuse the fact that you’re leveling in a group as much as possible. For example, in Act 2, your Boss killer could run to get to Fidelitas, your Support could run to Kraityn or Alira + Western Skill point, while your Bow Carry could run the Crypt Trial.
There are a couple of different places where this works, and we will outline the most obvious ones below.
- Act III: from Battlefront one part of the group runs Docks and the other part runs towards Lunaris.
- Act IV: one part runs left side (Kaom) and the other runs right (Daresso).
- Act VI: Support & Carry could run the Strand quest and Pantheons (including the ones in Act VII) while the Boss killer progresses.
- Act VII: Support & Carry can get to Pantheons while Boss killer progresses, and then call him in.
- Act VIII: one of you could go left through Bathhouse and the Imperial Gardens for the Trial and skill points, while the other completes the act through the right side.
To pull this off, Portal Scrolls are king! They’re really valuable in group play while leveling!
In acts IX and X you should not split up, and instead your Carry should Magic Find Blood Aqueducts.
Early Mapping: Setting Up
This section covers the initial steps you and your group want to undertake to get your Boss killer started on his journey to Atlas completion and your duo ready to farm a low level map to start making currency.
Stage One: The Setup
After you’ve finished the mini quest-line in the Epilogue, you’ll be able to start mapping through Zana’s Map Device. We have written out an entire strategy for you to use to optimize the way you work your way to a fully completed Atlas. Make sure to read through the sections thoroughly as the tiniest of mistakes could ruin the strategy completely.
This is where it gets a little bit tricky and a lot of this will have to be play-tested. Mostly, your strategy depends on how long you will be playing together for and how many hours we can account for. If you were to only play for 5 days, for example, it’s hardly worth to set up your entire Atlas with maximum Awakening bonus.
Assuming you are going for a full Atlas completion, though, for maximized returns on investments we recommend that your Boss killer maps solo while your duo maps together for the remainder of the first 40 or so hours. Ideally, your carry and support duo pick a map they’d be Magic Finding (examples could be Burial Chambers Map or Port Map) whilst the Boss killer prepares his Atlas for the swap to full high-end Magic Finding.
You can opt to have the boss killer help set up the temporary Atlas first, or you can just skip this part and minimize income to accelerate a fully completed Atlas (after the changes to the Atlas, the only thing you can really help with it is Awakening bonus).
Gearing towards the Headhunter
While all of this is happening, your team has a couple of objectives. You should aim to have a Headhunter by the time your Boss killer is ready with the set up of his Atlas because your carry player will need one to be able to carry your team. Hypothetically, on your first run you might have to settle for 3 Inspired Learnings instead.
Besides that, you want to have completed a full set of Magic Find gear on your carry. Most of his slots are locked in by Magic Find pieces. An example of a standard Carry build would look something like:
- Rare Spike-Point Arrow Quiver
- Bisco's Collar
- Greed's Embrace
- 2x The Pariah
- Sadima's Touch
- Rare Lion Pelt
Most damage comes from the support / cluster jewels / Berserker ascendancy and all of the slots are tailored to maximize Magic Find.
Your support player should also be relatively geared at this point. He could still be running with a Solaris Lorica instead of a Shavronne's Wrappings but besides that he should have access to all his other pieces of gear. A standard Aurabot Build at this point would look like:
- Alpha's Howl
- Ephemeral Edge
- Prism Guardian
- Lori's Lantern
- Rare Moonstone Ring
- Rare Citrine Amulet
- Sin Trek
- Rare Sorcerer Gloves
- Bated Breath
Your Boss killer should be ready to swap over to a Curse support as soon as you decide to fully swap to his Atlas (and probably move to T15+ maps with full investments like Sextants, Beyond map mods, Chisels, Scarabs, Fragments…).
A standard early Cursebot’s gear would look something like:
- Heretic's Veil
- Solaris Lorica
- Prism Guardian
- Ephemeral Edge
- 2x Doedre's Damning
- Vixen's Entrapment
- Sin Trek
- Bated Breath
Stage Two: Early Atlas Execution
Setting up the Duo
Since we won’t be using any obscene gear / scaling through Headhunter yet, we will have to rely on base damage and the power that our semi-scuffed support can output for our ranged damage dealer.
We will therefore find a map that is suitable for this. You are looking for a map with profitable divination cards that is relatively linear to clear (it is advisable to stay away from jackpot maps if you are not experienced doing this). Picking a map like Burial Chambers Map relies on your trading being efficient and mostly self-sustaining initially until you get your big ticket The Doctor. Generally, a safe way to tackle this is to farm maps that drop Exalted Orb cards like Port Map, Arsenal Map, and so on. These will provide you with a solid income throughout this phase of progression).
We don’t want to be stuck in a layout like Cells Map, because we’re all about abusing our lead and time is money.
If we were to pick Port Map as an example and we’re assuming they’re Tier 3 maps in the upcoming league, we want one of our Duo players to set up their Atlas by completing every Tier 1 and Tier 2 Map on the Atlas. Make sure to check your Zana to see if she sells any maps that can accelerate this. If you run out of maps that help your progress, use a Zana mission to refresh her maps and check again.
After you’re done completing all of those maps, you should be able to complete Port maps and sustain them fairly easily as long as you run them fairly decently. We suggest you do not use Cartographer's Chisel (you can start using chisels as soon as you feel like you have all the necessary items to start speedfarming) but just use Orb of Alchemy and only re-roll maps that are on the very bottom end packsize-wise (18% and lower).
Your goal is to just do as many maps as possible with as little downtime as possible to generate wealth quickly. If you have someone dedicated to selling your items (often referred to as a trader) you can pick up everything that’s 1 to 2 Chaos or more at this point. If your group doesn’t have this kind of player, you’re better off focusing on raw currency, 5+ Chaos and uniques and trying to make the support player pick up jewellery and a couple of Rare items so he can turn in some unidentified Chaos recipes. As long as Exalts are cheaper than 40 Chaos, recipes are a very solid source of income in you map fast!
Setting up the Boss Killer and Progression towards the Final Atlas
The goal for you Boss killer is to complete every single map in the Atlas, having maximum Awakening bonus and at least 20 Watchstones as fast as possible. The best groups usually accomplish this 48 hours after league start, but doing it in at most 90 hours is very acceptable.
Mapping: Completing your endgame Atlas
As our Duo is now making currency in low tier maps, your bosskiller can completely focus on setting up the Atlas you and your team are going to be using all of the remainder of your time together. We’re going to optimize for completion speed and it is important you understand that it’s not a problem to invest into the Bosskiller’s Atlas in the first couple of days.
Stage Three: Accelerating your Boss killer to a complete Atlas
It’s important you understand the general idea of what we’re doing here before I go into detail. You are basically trying to control the maps your Atlas is dropping by excluding certain drops from the loot table. If you can make it so you can control all T3 and T4 maps that drop, you’re gonna be on your way to 12 Watchstones with an incredible ease.
Completing Tier 1 & 2 Maps
We suggest your Boss killer starts in the center of the Atlas, as everyone else does, but pays very close attention not to complete any Tier 3 or 4 maps in the inner four quadrants of the Atlas. This is important for his Atlas control.
Both of your Atlas completers should be fishing for a map in one of the outer quadrants of the Atlas from Zana (or if your duo aims to farm a T4 map, and is able to complete T3 maps, they could farm all adjacent maps looking for a map in the outer 4 quadrants). You need to make sure you can set up an Atlas that does NOT drop T3 or T4 maps in the middle to accelerate the first four Watchstones in the outer part of the Atlas.
Getting the first four Watchstones
As we now set it up so our Atlas only has T1 and T2 maps unlocked, whenever we find a T3 or 4 map in an outer quadrant on Zana or because our duo got one from farming an adjacent map we can start mapping in one of the four outer quadrants. This is important since you need to spawn your first Conquerors in the corners of the Atlas.
As you don’t have any T3/4 maps completed, the map in the outer quadrant of the Atlas will only be able to drop adjacent maps which will keep you sustaining maps in the first outer corner of your Atlas. Every T3/4 map you will be dropping will solely be located in the quadrant you just started mapping in, giving us an easy first Watchstone. If you drop T3 maps now, and they are located in the Outer quadrant, you are allowed to run them. We just need to not run anything above T2 that’s in the middle 4 quadrants of your Atlas.
Both groups will be trying to get the Boss killer a second map in any other outer quadrant so that whenever the Boss killer finishes this first Watchstone he can move on. For him to move on, he needs to put the dropped Watchstone in the quadrant he just finished. That way that quadrant now only drops T6 maps or higher making it so if he puts a T3 or 4 in the map device, which we have again acquired from our duo or Zana, we will be sustaining maps in that quadrant exclusively (as we can’t drop any T3 or T4 maps in the center of our Atlas, remember).
By repeating this process 4 times you will very easily get to your first 4 Watchstones without ever struggling to sustain maps in the correct quadrant.
Moving on to Watchstones 5 to 12
Since our duo is still farming T3 Port Maps we can no longer rely on them helping us. The most ideal way to keep your progress going is to try and get your next Watchstones in the outer quadrants again.
We really don’t want to complete those high tier maps in the center of the Atlas to keep repeating the strategy we just used to guarantee map drops in a certain quadrant. To start this off, you’ll just put in a T5 map of a certain quadrant while this quadrant has one Watchstone socketed in to try and get it to drop a T6 map. Whichever quadrant the T6 map it drops is the quadrant you’re going to start in.
Once we started farming that T6 map, you’re going to have to keep track of how many maps you’re dropping in that quadrant and how many Conqueror maps you’re going to have to run before spawning your next Conqueror. This is shown through a bar on the left side of your Atlas page. If you’re on the early Watchstones you’ll always spawn a Conqueror after running 3 influenced maps.
This means we’d need 3 maps to drop in that quadrant of T6 or higher to spawn our Conqueror. It is important that you monitor this, because as soon as you have enough maps to complete this quadrant you want to unsocket your Watchstone and socket it in another quadrant. That way, we’ll have a single Watchstone socketed still in our Atlas, in another outer quadrant of our Atlas, thus forcing our Atlas to only drop T6 or higher maps in that specific quadrant.
If you execute this strategy correctly, you will always only be dropping maps you can actually run to work towards your next Watchstone and getting to 8 should be relatively easy and quick. It’s almost impossible to not be able to get maps to drop that keep you in a certain quadrant on T6 and T7.
After these 8 Watchstones, stuff gets a little bit more complicated in one way but also less tedious to monitor. As we are now going to complete all maps in the center that we skipped earlier, we’re giving up on the possibility to force our Atlas to drop a specific quadrant as map-tiers will overlap.
However, picking up your first four center Watchstones should still be easy.
The last couple of Watchstones
From here on out, we found it to be more beneficial for the Boss killer to start working on his Awakening Bonus. He will eventually be spawning Conquerors anyway, and our final goal is somewhere between 20-32 as we don’t really care about the last couple (since we can just fill missing Watchstones with uniques of off Sirus).
Make sure that you never put in a map that does not give you Awakening bonus unless you really have to and for some reason cannot access a map that does move you towards your goal. Awakening bonus is the most powerful scaling packsize mechanic in the game and is therefore the most profitable mechanic in the game.
Whenever your Boss killer reaches 150+ Awakening Bonus (depending on your speed, some maps might just be overly expensive to complete e.g., Perandus Manor and you can skip those) you should swap over, regardless of the Watchstones, if your gear is optimized.
You will just purchase unique Watchstones (e.g., ###item:Booming-Populace###) and socket them in regions where you will not be mapping just to make sure you will never consume them. They’re just there as placeholders because we will be spamming a single map in a single quadrant anyway.
Stage Four: Setting up your final Atlas
We should now have access to a fully completed Atlas. It should have 32 Watchstones (a combination between regular Watchstones & uniques), over 150 Awakening Bonus (for maximum map-mod and thus packsize / quantity scaling) and maximum Atlas Bonus (as we completed every single map).
Picking a Map
At this point we should already know what map we’ve been working towards. For convenience we will stick to the Port Map example (other potent candidates are Tower Map, Burial Chambers Map, Arsenal Map, Vaal Temple Map) where we want to just favorite Port map two times and favorite one other map. Don’t forget to favourite maps in your other quadrants as well.
The way you want to handle your favourite maps varies a lot on the quadrant you’re farming. We generally preferred to map at Awakening Level 7 and only socket 3 Watchstones in all quadrants we were not farming. Most of the profit of the new Atlas comes from Awakening Bonus anyway.
Doing it that way you’re only going to drop the T16s in the quadrant you’re targeting. In that case, double favoring your target map should make it so you have plenty of maps to sustain and it makes it so you can still use one of your favourites on another map in that quadrant.
We recommend you to re-shape your Atlas at the start of every playing session to optimize your mapdrops for profit. Check bulk prices on maps to see which maps you want to favorite at which tiers.
We finally get to start playing on our completed endgame Atlas. There’s a couple of things that are mandatory for you to understand before dipping into the endgame group mapping strategies.
First of all, there’s almost nothing you can do with your maps that makes you lose currency. You should not hold back on investing in them as your only limiting factor is time. You want to make as much currency per minute as possible and that means we want to maximize the return per map rather than the amount of currency made versus the currency spent on the map. On top of that, generally investing more means the returns only get better.
Rolling, Chisels, and Corrupting
The obligatory things we will be doing from now onwards (and we will pause mapping if we run out of these materials in case we don’t have a trader) is making sure we use Cartographer's Chisels on every single map. We also want to roll them decently well. Generally, our advice is to roll for 22+ pack size. Don’t worry about the quantity, as it scales linearly with pack size so you’ll always get decent quantity as long as you respect the 22%.
Whenever we built up our map pool to a point where we’re clearly over-sustaining, we’re going to start using Vaal Orbs on our maps to try and get as many very high modded maps as possible. Since the change of Zana modifiers no longer requiring extra Vaal Orbs on vaaled maps, there’s really no reason not to.
Next up, we’re going to need to set up Sextants. You will always use Awakened Sextant if possible as they’re just a lot better than the other ones. These have gotten a lot more “fun” yet also “complicated” since the changes to the Atlas as you can store certain sextants now to combine them.
Generally, if there’s nothing special on your map, you’d prefer using 4 added monsters sextants (e.g., “Area contains additional monsters that deal Cold damage” or monsters that convert when killed). Any of these, except the one that adds Physical Damage monsters, are fine to run on standard maps. Other sextant we don’t re-roll include “Magic Pack Size” and “Mysterious Barrels”.
Afterwards, there are specific sextants we want to be preserving. Things you want to hold on to are “Players cannot take reflected Damage” to combine with your maps that you’d otherwise not be able to run because they have Elemental Reflect, Increased Pack Size & Quantity in Unidentified Maps_ to combine with your unidentified maps (if you’re Vaaling maps already), “Nemesis monsters drop 3 additional currency items” to combine with maps that have “Increased Rare monsters” / “Monsters have a nemesis mod”), Beyond sextant (to combine with natural Beyond maps) and potentially the Strongbox modifiers to combine with the “500% increased quantity of strongbox monsters” sextant and to run with ###item:Monstrous-Treasure###. In case you want to save your sextants, you can just swap in another unsextanted Watchstone and keep the sextanted Watchstone in another quadrant. Just swap them in again when you get the right type of map!
Scarabs and Fragments
The last piece of our puzzle (ignoring league mechanics to abuse such as Harvest Gardens, Fracturing Beyond maps, and so on, for which you should check our league guides) is filling up the map slots. It’s usually best to fill them up with Scarabs.
This requires you to pay a little attention to the market. If there are a lot of high item level Elder-influence items, obviously, it becomes more worthwhile to use Elder scarabs. The bread and butter setup would be a map, a Divination Scarab (provided you’re running a map with good cards), an Elder scarab (Monsters and Bases) and two fillers. Your fillers would be any 2 Scarabs of the following list (Cartography, Legion, Harbinger, Metamorph, Ambush, Bestiary, Breach) depending on their prices and value. I suggest testing these out, as it is fun as a little experiment!
You’re now ready to start mapping. Make sure to use Zana’s Beyond modifier on every single map if it is available in the current league, otherwise Nemesis, Legion, and Metamorph are decent.
Atlas Passive Trees
With the introduction of Path of Exile’s Atlas of the Echoes Expansion we have gained access to Atlas Passive Trees. These are highly customizable amplifiers to your maps which give you the opportunity to interact with mechanics from past leagues. From a Group perspective you’re always going to want to run the mechanics that reap the most rewards which generally means you’re looking for passives that add monsters to a map.
Because you’re already investing so heavily into a map, adding more pack size (through whatever means, Atlas Passives being no exception) is further going to increase how much profit you get per map completed and will justify investing more and more into a map. We have a very Atlas of the Echoes Guide that summarizes all of the options. For Group Play I would say that Beyond, Harvest, Legion, Incursion & Breach are the top tier contenders. Should you not be using Delirium Orbs, Delirium passives also get added to that list. Additionally, Abyss and Blight are more of a preference. They still do add monsters but their reward generally feels rather lackluster.
Tips and Tricks to Get Better at Group Play
Practice Makes Perfect
No one who has used this guide as his baseline to start Magic Finding as a group did everything perfectly from the first try! As you do these kind of setups more often, you’ll get a feel for where you can improve as a player and where your group members could improve.
League-start practice is the biggest discrepancy between very good players and casual players. If you want to compete with the big boys, you’re going to need to do leveling practice with your group. Start by running to Act 3 (divide the quests and time them to complete them all together) a couple of times, then move on to Act 5. Once you feel like you perfected this, the next acts shouldn’t be ran more than once. They really aren’t that much different solo than they are in a group.
Your Carry Needs to Learn
In our experience DPS Carries often run away from danger when they shouldn’t, or stand still when they should be running.
Playing Carry is the most difficult role in the group so give him time to learn his limits and get a feel as to how he should be playing / how much he can take. Supports should communicate if they can keep him safe vs. an Abaxoth (for example), if he’s not very big from Headhunter stacks. Do note that your supports are usually (and especially when both stacked up or when around a Discipline support) unkillable so they can play a little bit more aggressively.
Level Gems & Dump Useless Sockets
Gems are the most underrated source of income in the game. We’re going to assume we’re leveling Enlighten Supports. Leveling an Enlighten Support takes approximately 2 days of playtime if you play decent sessions. Every player has at least 6 offhand slots (9 if we invest in Maloney's Mechanism).
The Carry player can probably find an extra 5, the Cursebot can probably find an extra 5, and the Aurabot can probably find an extra 4. We’ll save you the math, but that’s an extra 25 Exalts every two days just from leveling gems in the empty sockets in your gear. You could further optimize this by using level 4 Awakened Gems on your Carry and replacing them with level 1s whenever they hit 5 to then sell the level 5s and so on.
Mapwatch is one of the most handy tools when it comes to PoE. It allows you to check how much time you spent inside and outside of maps. This is very, very important if it comes to efficiency, and after all, if you want to make money, you’re supposed to kill as many monsters as possible.
Mapwatch is available for free and we recommend you use it. Good times to aim for would under 35 seconds in between maps and under 6 minutes in maps. Obviously, there’s more time outside of maps when you’re setting up you 20+ maps but that’s fine.
Spend Time on your Loot Filter
One of the most important aspects of speed is your loot filter. With the new function on
Filterblade, editing filters is relatively easy and should be something you want to get a hang of. The amount of loot will be so obscene that it’s generally not ideal to use a pre-made filter. You’ll also want to be editing in (and out) specific items that are worth picking up.
Aside from Jewels (which are impossible to filter as they all share a base) you generally should only see items you are picking up (meaning items worth over 10 Chaos, for example, and raw currency).
A Few Closing Words
A lot of this playstyle is based on experience and a really solid group of people to play with. Remember that in the end you’re playing a game and your main focus should be having fun. Try to have fun with your friends and if you eventually get the hang of making obscene amounts of currency, that’s just an extra, right?
For those of you who want to play with friends but never knew how to do so, I hope I at least provided some insight. I’m always available on the before mentioned means should there be any additional questions and as per usual I am very open to feedback through the comments.
If something comes back on multiple occasions I will for sure include it into the guide at some point.
This guide will be a “forever work in progress” as group play and optimizations for it never stop evolving. New optimizations will always be found and I will do my very best to keep this guide up to date as much and as frequently as possible.